606: How Can Sales Strategies Help Push Musicians & Artists to the Next Level!?

Chris Goyzueta  0:01  
Having a great marketing strategy is super, super important. But at some point, right? If you have the time you have the money, it's easy to get people to watch your video, it's easy to get them to listen to your music, it's easy to get them to your website, it really is easy. But at some point, if you're running a business, you have to monetize that business. So how do you get someone to actually spy something, buy a ticket, buy a product online? How come to a live event? Right? How do you actually sell something? So that's what we're going to talk about today. I'm super excited to have one of my really good friends, Brian Nichols on the show today. He's an amazing salesperson with over a decade of experience in sales. He's coached and manage teams. He's mentored and taught sales through over 100 countries of people. Even last month, He crushed his quota paying 234% of his sales quota. He's taught seminars on sales and really sales one of the most challenging things there is in the world. One is podcasts. He's literally trying to sell liberty to people, and she's trying to make people become libertarians. So nothing harder to sell than that. So I'm really, really excited to have my good friend Brian Nichols on the show. Life So buddy, how you doing? Mr. Brian?

Brian Nichols  1:25  
Happy Friday, my friend.

Chris Goyzueta  1:26  
Yes. Happy Friday. Welcome to the show. Finally. I know.

Brian Nichols  1:29  
I'm excited for this. Yeah, you've been on my show many a time we talk about selling liberty, you brought the marketing Liberty approach. And I'm hoping I can bring some sales experience and hopefully teach some of your your audience today how they can effectively sell whatever it is that they're selling.

Chris Goyzueta  1:46  
Absolutely, yeah. Yeah. And it's exciting. Because one, I mean, I've been on your show, probably more times, because you're way more consistent and better at this than I am. I teach this stuff and I'm super inconsistent. So consistency is the key. So this is the new streak where podcasts back, my longest streak, I think so far was 60 episodes, or 60 weeks in a row. So we're gonna try to break that this time now. And maybe there will never be a break again. But we'll see what happens. But to the listeners that are that are finally back, welcome back. And I mentioned this to Brian, the beginning, I'm going to try out a new format, where the first half of the podcast is the educational stuff. You know, as you've been people that have been here before, you know, I'm inspired by all kinds of different podcasters I love the long format of Joe Rogan. I love the heart, punchy quickie 30 minute educational podcasts. And I want to kind of combine the things that inspire me. So it'll be educational upfront, and then we'll go kinda long form and just get to know the person a little more and see where it goes. And a lot of times I feel like long form is more educational anyway. But anyways, so Brian, sort of sales, were waiting for someone to get because I know absolutely nothing about sales. So I guess, to two rookie that wants to get into sales wants to learn how to sell themselves like where did they even start?

Brian Nichols  3:01  
Well, you know, when it's funny, Chris is that, and we've talked about this in the show is that sales and marketing, while they are very different, they are like kissing cousins. In many cases, a lot of where you're starting off point for sales is also your starting off point for marketing. And this case is understanding who's your target market, who is it specifically that needs what it is that you're selling. And if you're able to instead of focusing specifically on the features, the benefits, or whatever it is that you bring to the table in terms of value, but rather focus on the meaning of that, that solution that product, that service in terms of what it does for your customer, right. So understanding who your target market is how your product not only helps them, but the meaning behind that. And then specifically, I would say also being able to get comfortable in a niche, figuring out the language of the people that you're speaking to. And then specifically what issues are creeping up as Top of Mind issues for them. And then for you to become comfortable and really feel like you're an expert in being able to not only articulate the solutions to those problems, but then you can lead with when you're talking to people and trying to in this case, let's say cold calling, for example, go out and enter into the conversations that people are already having, you know, those top of mind issues because you've been in that niche, you understand the language and the concerns and the obstacles that people are facing consistently. So now you can lead with that and present yourself as an expert. But in this case, an expert is giving real solutions to the table that aren't just going to be features and benefits that are consistently what you hear from sales folks. It's, you know, hey, I'm from ABC company, we do X, Y and Z. Do you want to book a meeting and that doesn't really work. What Works is being able to lead in with Hey, I'm calling from Stratus ip and you know, I wanted to reach out into a lot of work specifically with folks in the banking industry. I know right now moving from old legacy phone systems to more hosted solutions, but integrating that with Microsoft Teams is that's gonna be on your plate and then Beginning of conversation. So hope that answers your question. To start off crisp, I'd say to start number one, yes know your market. Number two, understand the meaning of what it is that your brain from your product or service to your, your, your prospects. And then number three, really go out and find that specific niche there you can get comfortable and speak your speak your expertise to your your target market.

Chris Goyzueta  5:22  
Explain, as I always say, know, your audience, right? And your audience.

Brian Nichols  5:25  
That's right, you own your audience, you've taught you that.

Chris Goyzueta  5:29  
Take take them off and still go third party platforms, but your audience will know your customers so well, right that if they were to walk into a mall, like you should know, what kind of customer are they and I always use, the example is, are they impatient, like me, and they know exactly where they're gonna go, go to that store, get what they need, and get the heck out of them all, like, the less time they spend there, the better or are they more like my wife, and they're gonna go shop around and take a look at this store and take a look at that store, and they go to the store they want to go to and then oh, try to Sorry, I'm trying to, you got to know your audience.

Brian Nichols  6:03  
And also, what you just kind of mentioned too, is your, as a sales professional, it's not our job to force people to buy, but more so to help them buy, right. So if we so use that great example there, if you're going into the mall, if you Chris, know what you're going into the mall for, right? In that case, as the sales professional, it's my job to facilitate that sale, as easy and as pain free as I possibly can for you. Whereas if it's your wife situation, then you're probably gonna want to do a little bit more of like a deep dive discovery almost like a quote, first appointment right with your wife to figure out what is it that she's interested in? What are the issues that she's trying to resolve as she's going shopping, is she looking for clothes is she looking for something household items, whatever it may be, but then to tailor in and hone in on whatever it is as a salesperson in that respect. So again, it really just comes down to the different approach that you have to take with what your buyers are looking for. And again, my kind of slogan I have on my show is meet people where they're at specifically on the issues they care about. But that first part, meet people where they're at, right, if you are able to enter in to whatever it is the conversation that the person is having, in their mind the problem that they're facing internally as a team, but then specifically help them through their processes, and just make it easier for them or have to play more of a hand holder, that doctor kind of go through uncovered the problems, maybe help walk through some of the solutions, and then really attach the meaning to the value you bring to the table to those problems and the solutions you bring to the table. In that case, then moving forward. So I say across the board, it is though, specifically knowing not just your market, but then how they want to buy and how they bought in the past. Right? That's also important. And you can you uncover that through the discovery questions, and really figuring out not just who your buyer is, but how they behaved in the past.

Chris Goyzueta  7:52  
Well, I think makes it tough for for musicians, I'd say especially musicians, so especially musicians that don't have a podcast or YouTube channel or something like that they're doing something else, right. So first of all, I'm a big advocate that if you're a musician, you should have something else right. So for the podcasters and YouTubers, it's a little bit easier. But the musicians that are purely just doing music, and you have something else, it's it gets easier, because you can sell that as your revenue stream. Well, let's say first starting out, you only have your music, right? And you mentioned resolving a pain point or something, a problem that customer is trying to solve. And entertainment is a problem. Just keep keep that in mind musicians entertainment is a problem that people are trying to solve right away as you create value is education or entertainment, and or utility making some easier, but I guess how do you sell art? Like how do you convince someone that your art is what's going to solve their problems?

Brian Nichols  8:46  
Your arts, the best art, the pretty boy saying the office pans are is the art. Now how do you sell art? And that's tough, right? Because not only is art it's not a physical I mean, it can be a physical thing. But let's talk about like musicians, for example, right? You're you're doing your service in performing and singing, you know, playing guitar, whatever it may be. It can't be it's hard to monetize that as like a deliverable, right. It's it's a service, it's not a specific product. So you're not necessarily solving a problem in this case, as you're you're providing a you're providing a solving have some emotional trigger that they have. So in sales, we're always looking for the two main triggers in emotion being fear and love and fear, I would say kind of maybe goes in tandem with sadness. Maybe that's kind of like in the same ballpark, if that makes sense. But when you're talking about how do you get somebody to like buy into your music or buy into your art, I think in this case, you have to hit them in an emotional an emotional way, Chris like you really have to figure out and then going back to who it is that you're speaking to who is your audience, but then what is it that emotionally drives them. And to to have a better understanding of your customer. I mean, one thing, I'm a really big fan of AJR. I think we've talked about this many times on my show. AJR is phenomenal in terms of not just their music, but also in terms of being there to connect with their fans. They do live streams on YouTube, where they're not only speaking to their fans, but they're also showing how their music is made. And it gives you as a fan much more I mean, even though you're not creating, it makes you feel like you have ownership of the music. Because when you go and listen to the music, you hear the little pieces that you were taught by the musician, right, and Ryan from the from AJR. So in this case, you get to build that relationship with your audience. But then you also get to have a dialogue with your audience, I always recommend to my sales team, when they start out, some of the first things they should do is to hop on some customer service calls, or at least hang out with some client care folks, and just better understand the problems and the realities that current customers face. Hop on some, you know, some demos with, you know, some some sales guys and hear how a sales process works when you're addressing those problems and concerns. And then you know, when you're going through and you're trying to do it yourself, it's going through and actually getting comfortable with the reps. You have to practice. Tom Brady, quarterback for the Buccaneers, back when he's with the Patriots. There's a story where he was he was with Julian Edelman, and he was the wide receiver for the Patriots. And there was one play in the Super Bowl prior that they had run. And if they had gotten that play, they would have gotten a touchdown. And they didn't get it and they lost the Super Bowl. I think that year to the Eagles, eagles that year, I think it was and I think the next year they went back I could be wrong in the dates there. But it's around that timeframe anyways, so they're in training camp the next year and they ended up there running the same play. They ran in Super Bowl that they didn't they didn't connect on and they ran the play and just like it wasn't super bowl ball felt incomplete. And Josh McDaniels, who was the offensive coordinator for the Patriots at a time said, Alright, next play, embrace it, run it again. And McDaniels is like, no, no, we gotta go to the next play. And Brady says, run it again. And McDaniels is like, Tom, we gotta go to the next play. And Brady just goes, Jake, listen, we we lost the Super Bowl, the most important game of the year on this play. So we're not going to move ahead until we get this play, right. So they ran that play five more times, until they got laid down. And the reason being is because until you get comfortable until you get your reps up, you feel more that you have control of the process. And then you can start focusing on the other things, but only then can you really feel that you're able to then really jump in and I think feel comfortable in the sales role. But going back all the way to your original question, how does that pertain to an artist, I think it's getting comfortable with the fact that you have to approach things a little differently. In this case, it's going to be speaking probably to your customers, your your audience. And then it might feel counterintuitive, because you want to write music from your heart, but write music from your heart that speaks to your audience, and then build up that relationship. Make them super fans, as you've taught me, and then let them help you sell your solution, just by the nature of them being your raving fans.

Chris Goyzueta  13:18  
As Keller Williams says, if your customers aren't bringing your customers, you're not doing it right. So yeah, you just sparked an idea, something I've actually never thought about before. So what a lot of musicians tend to do when it comes to the selling part, right? So they spent all this time writing a song, rewriting a song going into the studio, recording a song perfecting a song. And then when they release it, they just say new single coming out this Friday, co download it. And I think what was important for artists probably is the copywriting is like having really good copy to sell the song and you were talking about like, you know, what, what pain points is the song talk to you maybe like what emotions does the song spark? So I think, and then talking about getting the reps and as you mentioned, I think what artists should do and it's what actually gets taught a lot of copywriting courses is, you don't just write one caption, right? Like write as many captions as possible to fit it or figure out how to, in one sentence or phrase say what your song means or what your song is saying. And I mean, write it down at least 3035 40 Different captions to really kind of Yes, share the message that is maybe the point point that your song is talking to and maybe that's how you get someone to listen to. So I don't have much experience with copywriting. Like, what are your thoughts on that?

Brian Nichols  14:42  
Yeah, so I use copywriting all the time. I do it for my day job. For like what I'm doing just like cold emails, trying to get your prospects interested. I'm using it a lot for potential customers for my side hustle in terms of doing things for consulting but also for the podcast. Um, and with copywriting in, you can almost bring this to also when you're using this in marketing as well, Chris, right? If you can bring the copy to the video or you bring it to social media, and I'm thinking, you know, particularly, I've seen before, you know, there's a new hit that's being released or new single and I, I've seen like a music video preview, and it's usually focusing on you know, if I don't know why there's like one country music song in my head, I can't remem the name of it, but like in the song, they're talking about, like, you know, some very intense breakup. And I remember I saw this ad on Facebook, when I was going through a breakup in college back my freshman year, and it sticks with me, because like, as I was scrolling through Facebook, that ad just pops up and like, I you hear the song, and I'm not a country music fan, by any stretch of the imagination, but that's just sticks with us. I remember seeing that and being in that emotional state, it kind of hit me now, when it was a country music fan, in that case, right? That may have been a reason for me to go listen to that song. So I would say if you're able, when you're writing your copy to effectively focus on the in this case, it's a little different, right, because of the song. You know, maybe using your lyrics to help promote the emotional appeal, find that a very emotional part of your song and have that be a part of the copy have something with regards to, you know, telling a story of someone who enjoyed your music and the value they got from the music like that, because of the relationship that they were able to build with your music. There's so many different ways you can articulate these stories, but I think it really just comes down to knowing again, who it is you're speaking to. And know. I mean, I think I've broken record. But we I think sometimes Chris and I don't know if you've experienced this too, but we overcomplicate things, we try to like make things way more like I've listened to 1000s of podcasts over the number of years and listened to podcasts. And so many of these, you know, sales podcasts, in particular, all these sales gurus already have this acronym, and MDCP, a DDP method. And they go through each acronym, you know, M stands for meticulous as a number meticulously going through that everything, you know, line by line. And then you know, the A stands for and then it goes on and on and on. And every guru seems to think that they have to have this very intense, hard way of doing things. But the reality is, is if you are just able to know who you're speaking to know what it is that drives them on an emotional level. And this kind of goes to to empathy. I think empathy is one of the most underutilized, secret weapons that you can have in sales. Because if you're able to meet your your prospect where they're at, not just in terms of what they need from a solution standpoint, but where they are on an emotional level, and match that energy with them and kind of walk through Victor Antonio is a good mentor of mine here. He's a sales icon. And he always talks about his very gross analogy. He's like, you want to be there puking with them, you want to be throwing up with them, he's like, you want to be holding their hair back as they're puking in the bucket, feel that pain with them. And that's true, though. Because people want to feel cared for they want to feel that other people out there, not just care for them, but understand what they're going through, if you're able to show that differently than some of them. I mean, goodness, Chris, you told me some of the horror stories behind the scenes of artists who are so impersonal and just could not give a crap about their fans. And yet, then you look at the other folks, the other artists too, they build that relationship with people, they meet their fans, and really when they show that they care how much more of a positive impact does that have for not just that fans experience with their their icon, right, but now, they're gonna do so much more for you fly, they're gonna do so much more for you in terms of helping sell your products. So the celebrity the musician, the artist in this case, they're also getting something from it just like by showing they care by being different than those other musicians and other artists.

Chris Goyzueta  18:48  
Yeah, I think it's interesting because like, the whole like caring about others my first of all, it needs to be authentic, it needs to be real, you have to really care about people. But you know, like, there's a saying that artists are selfish, right? All artists assumption people in general like all people are selfish. And if if you're trying to do something that helps you like caring actually and empathy and like loving on other people, actually, in a way, like is the most selfish thing you could ever do because it's like nobody watch Friends at all and we talk about the office all the time but there's an episode where we're Phoebe says there is no such thing as a selfless good deed. Because of every good deed you get something out of it right even just feeling good. So don't even the feeling that you get out of helping is kind of selfish but so I guess if you're going to be selfish, learn to help and do something good with it like yeah, help others and be there for others because it's gonna return still make many times in your in your art and I'll never use an artist's name when I'm talking poorly, but I will use them when I'm talking to get So two examples. There is an artist from China North Star many number one hits record sold out arenas stadiums all over the world has been a judge on a singing show, Mitch was singing show and now can can barely sell a ticket to save their life. Right? Then there's artists that actually genuinely care and give a shit about their fans. And you see that that you know, backstage, how to interact with fans how to interact with the people backstage. And, sure, they may not be selling out arenas and stadiums anymore, but they're making deep into six figures per show. And they're selling out to 3000 seat theaters all over the country, and like over United States, and then maybe even other countries that might still be playing arenas. And those artists, they've built longevity rights, it's important to have a sight on the long game, like the long term picture, you're hopefully you're gonna do what you're doing for the next 2030 years, not get rich quick, because if the faster you get richer, faster, you get broke also. So anyways, where I was going out to, let's just kind of added some context what you said. But I think with the music too, once you get someone to listen to music, right? The sales part of it is like, unfortunately, music doesn't make as much money anymore as it used to. So try and get people to stream it is probably gonna be an important thing. But when you're playing live, I think the next thing you have to sell again, what artists tend to do they always get lazy when they sell something. It's like, Hey, we're going on tour, like, here's the 30 shows, I've come to get a ticket. And I feel like it was probably important to selling an experience.

Brian Nichols  21:25  
Yeah, you took numbers out my mouth, man, I was gonna say you're selling experience. And you know, like, I think the best way to really exemplify selling experience, it's a place we all I mean, we all used to know and love maybe not so much anymore was Disney, right? Disney was an experience when you went there, it wasn't so much that you were going to Disney. It's that there's, there's like the sense of magic, right? That's, that's there when you're at Disney World. I remember, you know, and I was fortunate as a kid, when I was growing up, I got to go to Disney a couple times. And you know, that's that's a big deal being from upstate New York. So going to Disney, I went and I was like four, I went again, then I was like, I think 10 Something eight, maybe I don't remember. And then I went again, when I was like 17, I had a nine, eight year old sister seven year old sister at the time, and to experience Disney at each of those phases in life. And I mean, obviously, when you're four your memories, not exactly as good as it is today. But I still remember the feelings I had, right and the experience that I had, and in the good the good memories that I associate with those trips. And then when I was older, and seeing my sister being able to enjoy and now her growing and getting these memories, and it's all based on the experience is based on the cast members coming up and trying to go above and beyond giving that extra effort showing you that they care. I mean, goodness, I kept I probably still have my parents house not gonna lie hidden in a box somewhere. My little autograph book that I got from, you know, Minnie and Mickey and Woody and Buzz when I was four years old, right, like, and I kept that because it meant something to me as a kid, I would bring it home and I'd show people like I got Minnie Mouse's signature. It's right here. It's the legit one. And like, that is something you can't really give a price to like, yeah, okay, yeah, Disney has a price and it's very expensive, right? But those memories that I have, that I'm sharing with you today, 30 years later, like those memories, still matter. Those memories still have emotion. It's why when I you know, I'm thinking about my future kid, right? Like, I'll probably let them watch some of the old Disney stuff because I have emotional connections to it. Right? And we see this across the board is that a lot of things this kind of sense of nostalgia carries through because of that the way it made us feel the emotions that we attach to it. And right now, Chris, what's missing? What's been missing the past two, three years. Stuff feeling like it matters like a lot of stuff we see especially up from your corporate overlords. If you want to be an artist. Here you go. You get Brenden rant mode here, Chris, you want to be different than your corporate overlords, or overlords. Don't put out the faceless, just generic bull crap that they put out time in and time out. Like I listen, I'm a Star Wars fan, as as true as they come. But like, as much as I tried to really love Obi Wan Kenobi. There were certain points in the film. I'm just like, this could have been like an hour and 20 minute movie. It didn't have to be a 10 series long movie because they kept on trying to like nostalgia junkie, you shot me, it was like, I don't need that. I just want to have, you know, a good story. But like, you see this time and again, we're across the board. There has been a lack of trying to create new things and it's been really trying to establish more of like, okay, what worked in the past where those emotions were working when we were winning that kind of battle. And can we bring that back? Hocus Pocus to I heard that that was recently announced there. No, it recently just came out right And I heard it sucked. Yeah, I know a bunch of millennials in my group that they're gonna go watch it and spend their time to watch it because of the feels. I liked hocus pocus. I'm not gonna go watch it I heard was a terrible movie. And frankly, like, I wasn't that big of a fan of it to begin with. But there are some folks, for them. That movie is everything. So they're like, Yeah, I want to feel like I did. Again, when I was a kid I saw I mean, I think I'll finish on this, Chris, it perfectly sums it up. It's a guy holding a DVD. And he's looking at the back of it. And it says, you know, I don't know if it's that I miss blockbuster so much is I miss the world like it was before 911. And I think that's kind of the the reality too, is a lot of us have this, this psychology for yesteryear, whether it was our parents thinking about the 50s, whether it's our parents now think about the 80s, whether it's about the 90s and 2000s. I think it's one of those things you see carry, you know, from generation to generation. But it feels really, really true right now, especially when you're just so much stuff just doesn't feel like it matters. And a lot of folks have lost that sense of hope that I think they're so desperately desperately looking for.

Chris Goyzueta  26:02  
What's I just listened to the Joe Rogan and Rick Rubin podcast. I don't know who Rick Rubin is. But one of the greatest producers of all time, like he was there, right, like at the birth of hip hop and has produced some of the best like hip hop records in the early mid 80s. Done like metal albums and chili peppers, system metallic, amazing, amazing producer. And he's like talking about art, right? Like what makes art unique and different. And I think the trap that a lot of artists fall into is following the trends, right? So when there is a trend, and he's just with everything, too, it's not just art, it's like everything was second, there's a trend, people try to jump on the bandwagon and try to capitalize and monetize on that trend. But again, that's thinking that's short sighted, right? I think in the long term picture is like, figure out how you can be different how you can stand out. I think that's, that's super important in art, and seems like it's really important in sales to Oh, not

Brian Nichols  26:59  
always important sales. It's one of the most, if not the most important things. It's certainly up there. You know, I'll give you a real life example. Right? So, for my day job, I work in the greater cybersecurity and telecommunications industry. And if you look at that industry, by and large, it's not that great. A lot of telecom companies are just faceless corporate entities, that for you, you know, when you're working with them, individually as a customer working in your residential space, right, you know, how just frustrated you can be the same thing is true in the business environment. So when you look at cybersecurity, same thing is true some companies done is when you have what's called the master agent space, which more or less you think of you like your insurance agents, you can go to state farm, or Allstate or progressive. Or you can go to an insurance agent who's gonna say, Hey, here's the best option for you. It's kind of what my company does, but we do it for small to medium slash Medium, Large ish companies who are looking for help in their business technologies base. So when you look at companies out there, like what my company does, some companies, they'll just be a quote, shop, they'll be like, alright, you need 300 phones, and you need one pen test and one vulnerability scan. Okay, we're gonna get you, you know, 15 quotes for your phones, and 10 quotes for the pen test, okay, versus what my company does, as we take it much more, you know, hey, we're going to give you one provider, we feel comfortable, not just selling but also supporting because we're here for the long haul, we're here to support your account from the onboarding where, frankly, a lot of telecom companies suck is the onboarding, provisioning, but also, post sale, we're here for the long haul client care, we're not going away. We're here to monitor your billing to monitor trouble tickets, actually, we're going to sit down with you quarterly to go through things proactively make sure things are being addressed in a positive way. You think other telecom companies just do that by the good nature? No, of course not. They they're like, we just need to get as many customers as we can. And once we get them make the contract language as confusing as possible. So they have a one year auto renew every year. And we can get them you know, looped in forever. And I'm not kidding, Chris, that's a real thing that happens all the time. But um, you know, us being different, us focusing, frankly, on the fact that we are different. We are not like everybody else is what in the end, at the end of the day sells us, it differentiates us. I'll give you an example. One of the accounts I sold last month, it was at the buzzer, and I say at the buzzer, end of month, end of quarter is a Friday night, and we were working on this account and ended up we had a special for them that we could only get through with the provider we brought in through the end of that that quarter, which ended at midnight. The guy called at 1147. He's like hey, really quick. Just want to make sure I'm confirming Billy doesn't start until January. Thumbs up contract came in a minute later. So like you were talking about at the buzzer. Right. But like that's the difference, right? Taking the extra effort. Another sales guy could just like now I'm not gonna answer that call. It's a late night. a Friday night, right? But at the same point in time being different doing the extra effort taking that extra initiative versus your, your competition, which, if you're an artist, it's other artists out there, unfortunately. Now, does that mean that you have to compete with them all the time, no, collaborate, build those relationships, as a matter of fact, use each other's audiences to work together. I think that's one thing, frankly, Chris, you and I have done a really good job with is being able to collaborate, bring each other's networks together. And we see this across the board, the liberty movement, I've been trying to work with other Liberty folks to build connections, because instead of having these like independent silos, where you just get your audience and you keep your audience, like build that silo, and then like, try to merge audiences try to share resources, because it's not just like this, like Oh, collective Utopia mentality, but rather, it's a mentality that like, if you help me and I help you, we are doing so because we understand helping each other is going to benefit us. At the end of the day, Chris, you know, this you're in, you're in art and radio and stuff, we what's the most popular radio station? Wi I fm? What's in it for me? Right? That's what everybody's always tuning into. So if we acknowledge that as the the fundamental reality, and then with that build upon it, versus just trying to ignore that, and then just blend in with the crowd, we're gonna find a lot more success.

Chris Goyzueta  31:24  
There's, there's one, there's so many great lessons to what you just said. But one thing that really stood out is the the post sale relationship, right? Because, again, always thinking long term picture, right? If you get someone to buy a ticket once, great. How do you get them to buy a ticket to your show for the next 20 or 30 years? And that's where the post sale relationship is important, right? One one giant artists that does really well as Taylor Swift. She has such a love and compassion for for fans, at least it looks that way. Right? It could be all be an act, but it seems authentic. It seems real. Her fans feel like it's real. And people come to our shows, they look forward to her shows like every year, every two years when she comes through town because it's that post show relationship as well as she tries to have a relationship with our fans for the long term, not just for that one show. And that's, that's what's so important.

Brian Nichols  32:15  
Really quick, by the way, is the guy you got me excited about was Gary Vee, right? Yeah, I got to get up here. I listened to Gary Vee consistently and let me tell you, Chris, like I'm so glad I do because that guy's positivity is freaking toxic, and I love it. But one thing that I've learned from Gary Vee is like the importance of engaging in your audience like there's one video I saw on his like a reel or something. He's like scroll. It's like him scrolling through and responding to every single comment. And like he's like, Oh, yeah. Mazoon and he's like, he's doing his thing. And he does that because I mean, number one, he gets a thrill out of it because he's a psychopath in the best of ways, but also because he knows that him putting in that effort now will yield so much more down the road. I mean, Chris, how many videos have you seen of Gary Vee like somebody comes in and be like, Dude, you saved my life? Yeah, go in for the bro hug and then tell like some terrible story that they were like on the verge of suicide right and like that's because he takes that extra effort. Sorry go on.

Chris Goyzueta  33:21  
No, that's great. Yeah, that's that's a really good example. That's still by the way the drinking game of my podcast when when I mentioned or someone mentions Gary Vee people got to drink

Brian Nichols  33:30  
my lemon seltzer water

Chris Goyzueta  33:33  
nice I'm drinking my my Celsius energy drink that my wife got me hooked up.

Brian Nichols  33:38  
Hey, go by the way I don't drink anymore. I

Chris Goyzueta  33:40  
tell you that it did something that I did. Yeah, it that's

Brian Nichols  33:43  
been the best decision I made man let me tell you what, like I feel so much better from not drinking the the alcohols and I think because I woke up one day and I was like, I don't want to feel like crap anymore. And like no more hangovers man and like mentally sharp. Like I think he was about superpowers for sales in life. Get substances out of your like, be present be focused, like, I'll vape every now and then. But like if you can try to like really be engaged. It's so much better. Like don't sorry, that's completely off topic. But like a superpower man, like I used to work with a co worker. You'd come in every Wednesday, Wednesday, yeah, Wednesday, hungover reeking of whiskey because he would go to play darts at night. And it was all every Tuesday night and he would drink an entire handle of I forget the Hennessy Hennessy if you're gonna tire handled NSC, and like just, you know, heroin be all disheveled written the booze, whereas like, you know, I can come in and I can feel like dude, I didn't drink at all like I start my workout this morning at 430 in the morning like

Chris Goyzueta  34:52  
now that it's so so true, right? The whole like taking care of your health. Especially as an artist, I mean, it's sad. anybody no matter what you do like taking care of your health is going to be make you so much better at what you do. And I know when it comes to art like sometimes artists get into drugs because it makes them more creative and blah blah. You can be creative without that and you can find ways to be become more creative like you're gonna ruin episode I was too apparently a Rick Rubin has never done drugs and he's one of the most creative people in history and he really is is an artist and how to pull the art out of someone. So yes, I second that wholeheartedly. I mean, I've recently gotten into a hobby that hopefully doesn't kill me one day,

Brian Nichols  35:38  
man, you're crazy. By the way, your your late 30s

Chris Goyzueta  35:43  
I'm 40 and I decided to still be I don't know, I just turned 40 in August and I started jujitsu and judo and tell you to judo practice like jujitsu when I first started, I started in February of this year, so have advisors and in future February 2022. So I started jujitsu. I go about four days a week. And it was pretty hard nobody. Then in September of this year, I started judo. And any jujitsu peers listen to this. Yes, jujitsu is probably the best self defense and they have the most vicious and violent chokes and submissions. But when you start standing up, and just most of jitsu is on the ground, when you start standing up doing judo. That shit is so hardcore. Like, I feel like jujitsu in a way is more violent. But Judo is more hardcore and Judo workouts. Oh my god, like this morning I did judo and just the judo exercises for warm up. Do you think like, thick and die like you're taking people you're saying body weights out of two or 40 pound guide and I'm like leg pressing, and then like, pushing off of my legs with me. And then like doing the thing called shrimping towards them and like pressing him again. It's It's insane. Alrighty then. Wow. Packages are beasts anyway. So yeah. Noted. So even so where were we? So taking care of your health, right? So doing something like that now, like I obviously got really into this, like days want to drink a little bit. I still drink but I drink liquor or anything like heavy like I drink a little bit of wine. One or two glasses is my cutoff. What the days where I drink a little bit more than two glasses. I don't sleep as well. I wake up a little more tired. I don't train as hard. I might skip training because I don't feel good. Right. And imagine what what that does to your to your art. I mean, yeah, maybe not motivated to right. Maybe not motivated in that. So yeah, taking care of your health is the most important thing.

Brian Nichols  37:38  
By the way, I used to weigh 385 pounds. Like for me, my health is like my most important thing beyond like family and such like, like health for me is so paramount because I've been there like, you can't do anything. It's 385 pounds, you can't function well. And like, Okay, I'm six foot four and three quarters, that was my football. You have to have that to the outlet. You can't give me the quarter inch to be six, five or like, Nope, it's six, three and three quarter min. Okay, exploring three quarters, whatever. But like, for me being that tall, carrying 395 pounds, didn't look that bad. I was also a little muscular for a big guy at the beginning. But then I was like, You know what, I lose all this weight. And I did it last 100 days, my pounds. At first. It was cardio, like literally all I did was cardio. And like that was like God like 15 years ago. But at that point, like that's what I needed. And then I started lifting weights. And then like getting into that routine of lifting weights, doing cardio, going to the gym, like can sit eating healthy, trying to get enough sleep, like all those things. And they start to compound and then you realize like, Yeah, this is important because as soon as one thing goes out, like to your point, you drink more than two glasses all sudden, like your entire house of cards starts to crumble. And it's like it's so hard to build it because then it's like you're trying to run in sand. It's like you're getting their butt like you're just getting pulled right back down every single step. But for I mean, for me, my hell if I'm not 100% knee, and this is where sales to like, I can't be 100% me in a sales demo. If I come in hungover, and I'm working with like C level executives, I can't talk to a chief information officer or chief information security officer for a massive Corporation and be hungover instinct, right? Like, it just doesn't work. And this is something I think a lot of folks have to kind of like come to reckon with is like, there comes a point you almost have to grow up, right? You have to realize like, what are your priorities, if your priorities aren't to be successful, and you have to start doing the things that are going to put you in that path to be successful? You're gonna be doing the things that don't work, and you continue to do those things that don't work. Guess what? You're gonna get more of the same things that aren't gonna work.

Chris Goyzueta  39:44  
Yep. Andrea, if I found this crazy what did you do so you say started mostly cardio in the beginning? Yeah, I guess up until how much weight did you lose since you started lifting weights? And then I also the other part is like, what was your diet like? Because there's a saying in the fitness world, abs are made in the In the kitchen, not in the gym, right? So you can train as hard as you want. But you may not lose any weight because you're still eating like shit. So what was your diet like in the beginning part? And how much weight did you lose? When you started picking up weights? Yeah, so

Brian Nichols  40:12  
I ended up I didn't know weightlifting at all. To start out, all I did was I. So it's funny, I did three parts really of my initial weight loss. This took over two years, by the way for the 180 pounds. So first part was, again, going back to my background a little bit, I'm from upstate New York family was a family of farmers had this 250 or so long, a footlong barn and it was empty. No more cows, I got sold away back in the mid 90s. So we had this big empty barn sitting there. And being 385 pounds at the time, I was like, I, I don't want to go to the gym, I look like a monster like i don't i just i was so uncomfortable. My own skin, I would wear such baggy clothes, but even then I just didn't feel like I was feeling comfortable. So what I do is I'd go out to my barn at 730 or seven to eight o'clock at night or so. And I'd go out there for about an hour to two hours. And I literally just walk up and down the middle of the barn and I would do all 250 feet down to 250 feet back. I just do that on loop for you know, an hour or two hours. And mind you this is upstate New York. This is an I started this back in January of the I think it was 20 Or does it 2008 Maybe it was so yeah, it's 2008 when I first started this so that first period was pretty much 2009 Excuse me 2009 That first period of like weight loss where I lost my initial like 340 pounds was me literally just doing that. Also, from the diet standpoint, just initially cutting out soda soda is poison it is get it out of your diet immediately. If you drink it consistently like turn it into a like, Oh, I'm in a bad boy kind of thing. Like that's what you should have soda for not for like, Oh, I'm having it for lunch every single day. Don't do that. I'm doing now alone and cutting out all the excess sugar and helped me lose like 40 pounds that right there at the onset. Then once I started getting more comfortable with like, Okay, I don't look like a monster anymore. Then I started to go out and walk on the roads. Now again, middle of nowhere in New York, back roads, probably. You know what I walked this route. I used to walk back when I visited my parents house back this past summer. And I'm walking this route with my wife and I stopped and I was like, I did this route. I would have go out at four in the morning. Pitch Black. And like, there's bears up there. Like, like it's there's no lights at all. Like if you're talking about, like, imagine the darkest night you've seen, right? That's how dark a normal night is with you're not in a big city. And that was not like you you're out in the morning. And if it's pitch black outside, it's pitch black outside and like I'm this ginormous Roatan kid wearing all black, like the fact that I didn't get hit or attacked by a wild animal. absolutely astonishing. But I did that for about like a year literally, I'd go out, I'd walk all the way to the river, which the river separated Canada, the St. Johns River for the folks playing in along with the home game and walk home and that was about like seven and a half eight mile I think it was round trip altogether. So I did that lost more weight and then that winter going in 2010 I ended up I started doing more going to the gym and I started running there because like wintertime cold near like, we'd have 40 temperatures in Northern New York. You can't walk outside like it's impossible. So I went to the gym and it was very weird to go to the gym at first because I was not comfortable with it at all. Jim for me it was like you know the opposite of where I want to spend my time like that's like so outside of my comfort zone. And why did I just go go on the treadmill walk sometimes go on the the bike and stuff I was also playing football at this point too. So like be more comfortable like working out with with people but I wasn't really like weightlifting because at that point in time, I was just a big guy and I've had a big muscle mass or being a big guy so I didn't feel like I do. So anyways, then I started losing more and more weight and I hurt my knee playing football, lost more and more weight and I got down to the end of my senior year of high school I think it was I was down to like 250 ish pounds I think it was and then the last 50 When I first went to college and I just again was only doing cardio only running jogging on the treadmill and outside and then I got down to my lowest lowest was 205 pounds. And that was over a two year period and then after that I started lifting weights and adding that in my routine and I sit now around like between my playing weight right now is like 250 to 270 That's kind of like my range. I said independent if I'm bulking or cutting, but beyond that though, like I would say to your your diet question. I have celiac disease so it's already difficult for me to eat food. I mean I can't have any bread or you know flour, wheat products, anything like that. That cuts out like a majority of alcohols as it is can have beer can have rye, barley, whiskey, anything like that. So I just kind of changed my diet to being more keto ish, I guess, if you will I eat pretty Whole Foods, you know, red meats, chicken fish. That's so much fish, seafood more than anything. But then your vegetables, healthy carbs, potatoes, mostly lots of potatoes.

Other than that, I would say that's kind of my, my main, my main change I took. And I'll tell you, though, like just doing something, though, and this is like, it's not just the physical part, though, man. It's like, it's the mental part of it, too. You know it right? Like when you're working out and doing jujitsu and stuff, like, the mental game that you get to play, but then that, like a feeling afterwards of like, oh, yeah, I did that. But yeah, that's so huge, of checking a massive thing off your list for the day, because that's like a big thing that a majority of people don't do you just doing that puts you in a completely different ballpark than a majority of other folks out there. So do that.

Chris Goyzueta  46:08  
Yeah, it's amazing. I mean, the discipline that it probably took to do that over and over and over for years, you know, it's like, a lot of people again, think about playing the long game, what your music career, whatever career it is, it's, if you want to be healthy, like you can't think about like, Oh, I'm gonna lose 5060 pounds over the next three, four months, and then I'll be healthy for the rest of my life. No, it's It's a lifetime commitment. Like, you just got to think forever. So that's what that's why even like, for me, like, there's, there's a way I want to drop, but it's, it's there's no rush, like, so I've lost almost 80 pounds now. And but I've done it. I've done it very slowly, because I'm trying to change my lifestyle I'm trying to focus on on longevity. And it's so important to take care of yourself. Like everything, everything gets better. I've dealt a lot with with depression throughout my life. And maybe you know, we're almost at the end of the conversation for a later day. But I will tell you some starting jujitsu and eating better this year. So I'd probably have to have like an episode of we're pretty deep depression, maybe once a month. This year, isn't it? Yes, we're in October, it may happen once. So even even in that sense, like your mental state is just gets so much better by taking care of yourself. And I think your art will get better your sales will get better your life, relationships, everything just gets better when you take care of yourself.

Brian Nichols  47:32  
I mean, Chris, and I mean, I don't want to share too much. Right. But I know, you and I had talked at one point last year, and there were some health stuff that you were a little concerned about.

Chris Goyzueta  47:40  
Right? And like blood pressure issues,

Brian Nichols  47:43  
right? Like, and that's stuff that it adds to the mental angst, right. And that's also something that we're facing a lot. I mean, people are bombarded with stimulus day in and day out. And it's like, it's exhausting. And then add one more thing of uncertainty when we're already uncertain. And like dude, like, life is so freakin short. Like one of my dear friends and mentors, Gary Collins just passed away. And it was tragic. He passed away they found him. I think the story I'm hearing now is he was visiting some friends and it sounds like it may have been carbon monoxide poisoning. So like something right? Like, like, what what is like, it makes you really take a step back and objectively, like, analyze things in life and like, do the things that matter but also like, to your point, you don't don't go crazy, like it is a process. Take your time. And like don't don't put yourself in a situation where you're gonna hurt yourself or like not see the long term results. I've seen people go on, they're like, Oh, I'm gonna do this crash diet like it's one guy Chris. I couldn't believe he's doing this. I think it's like a 90 day water fast. Oh, she's like, Yeah, and like He's like, he's like I can do it. Like I'm being monitored by doctors and there's no health reason to do he just wants to do it. i Hey, if you want to do it, that's fine. But like, there's other things you can do. Challenging

Chris Goyzueta  49:14  
out other things you could do?

Brian Nichols  49:15  
Come to the gym with me like five days in a row. I'll have you praying you did the water fast.

Chris Goyzueta  49:21  
Come to jujitsu, me I'll choke you around a little bit.

Brian Nichols  49:24  
I'll give you a water fast. Like there are so many different things you can do. And you know, it's funny. I don't want to make this about cybersecurity. But like I have this one guy we work with and God bless him. He's a he's a fun sales guy. But he has his ongoing phrase he uses for his company's cybersecurity solution. That cybersecurity is a process. It's not a product, right? And we see this time and again, I have people I'll call into and you know, I bought this, you know, amazing endpoint security solution. Top of the line, you know, has everything I need. place great Hey, you know what, what are you guys doing for penetration testing? Why do I need that I have this. Well, it's gonna, even though is great setup it's going to uncover if there's anything out there, it's gonna look in the dark web, see if there's any passwords or user credentials, we're gonna layer and maybe phishing campaigns, for example, to help your users be prepared for phishing attacks. And we don't need that. I No worries call back seven months later. Yeah, I have no budget because we got hit with a ransomware attack. And it costs us $100,000 a day for two weeks. And yeah, now my company is pretty much at a standstill, because we're still trying to get our data back. It's like, Ha, and you had this amazing endpoint security solution that didn't, didn't, didn't work. And like it's because people think they can take the pill, right? They think they can check the box. They think that as long as they do that one thing, and they're set, they're safe, they're good to go. But it's never it's never over. It's a consistent process. And whether it's your health, your cybersecurity, your music, exactly. There's always something that you need to be focusing on and trying to get better at, or to try and grow at because if you're not, and your competition is, and all it takes is one Chinese app company like Tic tock to come out of nowhere and like wipe out the American social media and empires that were here that we were guaranteed by the way, Chris could never crumble, right? They're monopolies. They're not going anywhere. And then tic TOCs like, hold my beer hold my hand or whatever. My Chinese beer is Chinese, Chinese. Philadelphia or Pennsylvania? You're right. It's the oldest American. I hope not. I'm sorry. fans out there who might think? Yeah, yeah. Drinking? I'm pretty sure. Seltzer here. Or nothing? No, but no, I would say no. 100% Because at the end of the day, like, if across the board, like from our conversation today, I would say if we could take anything away, it's you have to be different, right? Like you have to be and not just different, but like uniquely you in stand for something right? Um, I don't know about you. But like for me, I get excited and seeing people get it and then like being able to move forward, like whether it's a prospect I sell to a musician I'm sure you work with it's like, oh, I got the aha moment. And then they start just like ramping up like they're just they're skyrocketing. Like, whatever it may be. You get that kind of feeling like it's because we're trying new things. We're getting comfortable with being uncomfortable, but we're doing so by being uniquely us. We're building our relationships, we're surrounding ourselves with good people. We're being consistent. Well, Gary Vee say, am I allowed to swear in this, Chris? Yeah. Gary Vee would say be consistent as fuck, right, like Gary Vee approach to life. And but it's true because as soon as you take the pedal off the metal, somebody else is flying by a tick tock is flying by it with their younglings Yeah,

Chris Goyzueta  53:13  
it's always so fun, like doing a podcast with you. Because I feel like there's so many lessons from from this conversation. You're even going on a tangent even in attendance. There's, there's lessons, right? The important thing is being authentic, being different, and being consistent for a long time, which in the verse Gary Vee means just be patient as fuck, and just wait. And just keep going and keep going and keep going. And eventually, the magic will happen. Just gotta trust the process. Amen, brother.

Brian Nichols  53:42  
Amen.

Chris Goyzueta  53:43  
This is fun, man. As always, I'm just talking to you.

Brian Nichols  53:46  
Likewise, I know I'm looking forward to you and I getting more of these back on the episodes I know. So hi, my audience. We're gonna we're gonna do this as a rear on my show for our Friday episode. But like, Chris, these conversations, I think, to your point, I always get value from them. I know my audience always gets value from them. And frankly, like, this is how we grow as as a society, as a Liberty community, as a community of artists or entrepreneurs. Like we have to work and speak and network together. And understand that like, without each other, it doesn't matter. Like like, it doesn't matter how great you are individually without your customers. But likewise, it doesn't matter how great you are individually without your network. So let's let's focus on building those relationships, building up our network and building some value doing so uniquely.

Chris Goyzueta  54:36  
Thank you, buddy. Yes. And speaking of a network and connecting where can people connect with you?

Brian Nichols  54:41  
Absolutely. i Okay, so a couple places number one for like the media empire for all links and everything. Brian Nichols. show.com The Brian Nichols show.com. What can you find there? Number one, you can go ahead and find all 600 Plus episodes. Chris, can you believe that? The week I know

Chris Goyzueta  55:00  
When we first met, it was like 100 something,

Brian Nichols  55:02  
and you will and that's what happens when you do five days a week, I guess so and we weren't doing seven and that was just suicide. So we will round it back a little bit. Remove those two weekend episodes, at least decompress. But now we're doing five days a week, Monday through Friday 95. I'd say percent of my entire audience listens to the show via our podcast medium because frankly, that's where we all started was over back in 2018 on the podcast, so if you head over to wherever it is, you listen to your podcast, Apple podcast, Spotify, Stitcher, SoundCloud, you name it, just search Brian, The Brian Nichols Show, we should show up we are I was astonished to learn this in the top 1.5% of podcasts globally according to listen notes. So hey, we're making an impact I guess we're doing something right. But what we focus on is how can we bring political solutions to folks out there who are looking for some solutions, but do so overtly outside of the political system and infrastructure and what we do is we bring sales and marketing techniques that I use here in the my day job and in the private sector and bring them to the world of politics showing you how to win a hearts and minds versus trying to win arguments in terms of where folks can follow me on social media it's everywhere at bead Nichols liberty and then for all the video versions of the show yeah, we're trying to grow our video platforms as well so YouTube we have all the shows that that we've had here since we started recording video per Chris's very, very wise recommendation. Thank you, Chris. recording audio,

Chris Goyzueta  56:31  
video, audio over camera.

Brian Nichols  56:36  
And it paid off because now we have a nice audience there over on YouTube and also we recently launched over on Odyssey as well as on rumble so yeah, looking forward to growing those audiences as well but otherwise if you guys want to get in touch with me social media or you can email me Brian at Brian Nichols show.com Chris do that it's been a blast. Thank you so much for having on the program

Chris Goyzueta  56:57  
of course it was a real honor to finally have you on my show and it is it is a dual air show for Brian's audience I keep it simple gonna connect with me I have making it network dot XYZ Yes, I went the whole crypto blockchain route with the XYZ so make it network that XYZ that's where you can right now goes to the YouTube channel but I will direct that link wherever I wanted to go to find me and that should be the link for going forward. But everyone listening as I always sign up, I would say spread love, positivity and kindness in the world and live the life you love. Peace, my friends.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai